Attorney Discerning

Just another poor dumb sinner; trying to do what he can for Christ & His Church

Thursday, March 02, 2006


A very important decision, I know – why not the Benedictines, or Franciscans, or maybe the local diocesans? Or how about one of the newer more expressly orthodox orders?
I definitely lean orthodox/conservative. So why the Jesuits? {Well perhaps I’ll get into that later}

However, I am soliciting comments.
Are they really that bad?
Are they really that good?
Can I best serve the Lord in that Order?
What are the pro’s & con’s?
Any adhoc advice?

Please advise.


At 10:58 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

go team

At 11:21 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I guess to answer this question I would have to know you. I do think the orders have been awesome. The Jesuits maybe more than any other. The church needs them. I beleive the new evangelization will be led by the orders. This has been the case historically. The Jesuits need to reform themselves before they can reform the church. If guys like you don't join it that is not likely to happen. The liberal thinking you find in the Jesuits is a reason why you might be needed and a reason why it might be very hard. I find it hard when my local priest does not follow Rome. I can't imagine how hard it gets when your order controls your whole life.

God bless you in you discernment.

At 11:36 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I am 6,2 - 220 pound white man with blond hair and blue eyes (the women love me)"

Uh, I think you need to grow up a little first...entirely inappropriate for, actually, any man to put on his blog, but especially a potential priest. Unless you're trying to convince yourself of something...or other.

At 11:56 AM, Blogger Fitz said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

At 12:09 PM, Blogger Fitz said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

At 12:10 PM, Blogger Fitz said...

Anonymous #1. Thank you.
Anonymous #2. The description was in lieu of a picture. (I’m not that blog savvy yet- to post one) Although it sounds sophomoric; it is true, I am popular with women. I think I made that remark so that no one would get the idea that I’m homosexual. Its generally assumed that a larger percentage of the Priesthood is gay than the general population. I believe this to be the case. One of my difficulties in discerning the Jesuits is whether or not they will follow Rome and try and weed out homosexuals in the Priesthood. If not they could easily become known as thee “gay” order. This would profoundly affect my loyalty to the order & I believe my effectiveness in evangelization.
(anyway – not my final thought on the subject)

At 12:33 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

it was my experience at a jesuit university that called me to convert from a secular, self involved, agnostic life to the catholic faith. i have nothing but wonderful things to say about the jesuits and the work they do.

also, i think every faithful person knows this is not a question that can be answered by soliciting opinions on a blog. only prayer and spiritual reflection can give you your answer.

that being said, here is my advice: first, why the jesuits? if you disagree with their philosophy about what christ requires of them, then you should seriously consider WHY you are even thinking of dedicating your life to this order. are your intentions noble? the vow you take is a promise you make to God, a sacrament, make sure you do it with a pure heart, not a political one.

as far as your concern for the gay issue, on this particular jesuit campus i percieved a variety of opinions about homosexuality. one priest sponsored the gay-straight alliance on campus, another helped to craft the amendment to the state constituion banning homosexual marriage. yes, the jesuits do have a more liberal take on the gay issue, but you are the one that feels called to join the order. why is Christ calling you to do this? keep an open heart(and mind).

(personally, i think Crist tells us that the book of leviticus is not as important as "the new and everlasting covenent." you know, the whole "what you've done to the least of my brothers..." thing. i think the church should strive for a christlike way to express its opinion of homosexuality.)

i pray that you make the right choice for yourself and God. Good luck, keep us posted!

At 2:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Fitz, you wrote: "I definitely lean orthodox/conservative. So why the Jesuits?

. . . I am soliciting comments.
Are they really that bad?
Are they really that good?
Can I best serve the Lord in that Order?
What are the pro’s & con’s?
Any adhoc advice?

Please advise."

Why the Jesuits? Why, indeed?

If you lean orthodox and conservative, and like asking and answering questions (and your post itself suggests that you do), then why not consider the Dominicans?

Have you ever read the Dominican, Saint Thomas Aquinas?

Signed: Marion (Mael Muire)

At 3:32 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you are a Faithful to the Magisterium Catholic you might wish to contact some Faithful Jesuits e.g. Fr Mitch Pacwa, Fr Robert Spitzer, Fr Fessio or any other Faithful Jesuits and ask them if they think you should enter the Jesuit novitiate.

Some provinces are more Faithful than others. Go to the websites of the various provinces, your sensus fidei will tell you which are Faithful and which are beige.

The Rev. Vincent Capuano, SJ wrote an article in Adoremus which you might like to read.

At 5:05 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Are you really a thirty something lawyer?
To be honest this blog reads more like the blog of someone much younger.
Why do you think it necessary to tell us what you look like plus the comment - 'women love me'.?

How come you used possessive apostrophes for 'pros' and ' cons'?

At 5:32 PM, Blogger Fitz said...

Thank you all for your comments. They have been helpful and along the lines I was looking for.

Anonymous at 3:22 – Thanks for the Article I have printed it out and will read it.
I have also noticed the exceptional Jesuits you mentioned and thought of contacting them directly. I have also searched the web sites, but am informed there are only three major seminaries for Jesuits here in the U.S. (N.Y. Chicago, & California) Its really about what seminary is best. (and I’m not sure the choice is mine)
Thanks for the good advice, please keep it coming.

Anonymous 5:05
Yes I am. This is just a quickie blog to solicit advice. Yours is the second comment about my self-description and attractiveness comment. I believe I will remove it (just filler really – did not quite know what to write)
As far as possessive apostrophes are concerned, I guess I must have a good secretary. (She usually catches these things.)

At 6:53 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'll admit that "lawyer thinking about becoming a priest" makes me think "Jesuits." Which may not be altogether flattering to either lawyers or Jesuits.

But if you're genuinely considering the Jesuits, my one piece of advice is: ignore all advice from the Internet, and go talk to the Jesuits.

At 9:09 AM, Anonymous Robert King, OP said...

I would second much of the advice given here, especially:

* Talk to actual Jesuits; learn about the various provinces and where you might best fit

* Read St. Thomas Aquinas, esp. his Summa Theologica II-II questions 179 through 189, paying particular attention to qq. 182, 188 and 189. Remember that the Jesuits were founded after St. Thomas, and are not strictly speaking an Order, but are a Society of Apostolic Life (the Code of Canon Law may help you here). I'd also second the recommendation of the Dominicans (Order of Preachers). Here's the Western Province Vocation Page, and here's the Midwest Province, and here's the Eastern Province.

Further, I would recommend finding a good spiritual director: probably a priest who is or is himself a Jesuit or is familiar with the Jesuits, but also someone who will work with you to listen for God's call to whatever life you may have.

One last recommendation, a book that helped me in my own discernment: Fr. Simon Tugwell's Ways of Imperfection, which is a kind of historical survey of religious life and spiritual movements in the Catholic Church.

If you'd like to talk to me directly, Mark Shea has my email address.

At 2:04 PM, Blogger catholictriathlete said...

I too am a catholic lawyer (real estate)in the Detroit area, although a little older. I went to U of D Jesuit back when it was called U of D High, and I loved the Jesuits. I do have concerns about their orthodoxy, and soemtimes I wonder if their former role in the Churdh is being taken over by the Legionaries of Christ. You should consider going to a Retreat at manresa, and meeting the Jesuits thre and talking to them about your concerns. If you e-mailed me I'd be happy to get toghether with you.

At 3:21 PM, Blogger Fitz said...

Advocates of same-sex “marriage” who purport that it is not constitutionally mandated (that is: traditional marriage is not unconstitutional) yet feel that same-sex “marriages” should be recognized by the state (as California wants to do) need to consider the political reality of what the Massachusetts and other court have done.

Absent the extra-legal judicial rulings from courts like Massachusetts, the political movement for same-sex “marriage” has a hard time getting off the ground. Only after the idea is established that same-sex “marriage” is not simply a innovative and progressive public policy idea, but that opposition to it is unconstitutional and bigoted can legislatures like Washington adopt civil unions as a realistic political goal.

That is: We see hear judicial activism as not merely bad law, but as an active & indispensable part of a political campaign. I think there is too much divorce. If I could get a state court to declare divorce unconstitutional it would launch a national discussion about it. While most people would continue to believe it should be permitted, a lot more people would become both sympathetic and acclimated to the idea that dramatic changes to our current divorce law are necessary and possible.

That’s why strict constructionism and originalism is a suckers bet for conservatives politically. The possibilities of conservative judicial activism are to rich and varied. To concede such a powerful political weapon to the left, while standing up for the “integrity of the law” is to deny the reality of what they are effectively accomplishing.


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